DRESS CODE

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girlwholived said:
I am very political. I know we are allowed to wear any shirt we want as long as we have a vest on I want to wear a black lives matter shirt. Do y’all think they’ll dress code me for this?
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You probably will be politely asked to put on a non-political shirt. If you decline, they probably won't write you up but you'll find your hours cut and maybe feel a lot more criticism for little teeny "mistakes" (hint, hint performanced out). This will occur because it's not good business for a brick & mortar retail discount store - one which seeks to be the "go-to" store for an entire community, not just people of a certain political view - to allow staff to wear explicitly-political attire while on the job.

As I mentioned in an earlier response: if you can wear political statements on your work clothing, then how would you like seeing co-workers, TLs and ETLs wearing T-shirts and other clothing with slogans like "I Want Gay Married Couples To Protect their Marijuana Plants with Guns"? How about "John 3:16: For God So Loved the World...."? How about "Trump/Pence 2020: Make America Great Again"? Or best of all: "Say No to Credit Cards: In God We Trust, All Others Pay Cash"?

Those distractions are not good for business, not good for profit-and-loss, not good for employees who could lose hours and jobs.
 
Reminds me of why we stopped allowing Salvation Army to set up their collection kettles during the holidays.
Aside from the notoriously unreliable kettle folks (frequently trying to leave the kettle at the service desk while they took a break only to never return), leadership said it would open the door for a garden variety of organizations demanding the right to solicit our guests.
 
Does anyone hear themselves... “advertising any side of something” this isn’t a political view. This shouldn’t be picking sides. Black lives do matter. That’s a human statement not a political statement. If you can wear pride merch to work you can wear BLM merch to work. And if that makes anyone uncomfortable, they have inhumane beliefs and should in no way be catered to. There are as many people in the world who don’t believe in gay and lesbian rights but Target freely allows team members to wear pride merch. There should be no difference with BLM.
 
How about this. Next time you have a traffic ticket, show up in court wearing a bikini. After all, it is perfectly acceptable outerwear. You can wear a bikini at the beach and the pool, so its legality as outerwear is well established.

Or your next job interview, wear jeans that are so torn your underwear peeks out and a t-shirt with oil stains.

Or exercise clothes to your best friend's formal wedding.

No? Why not? Is it because they are not appropriate clothing for the setting?

How would you like it if your doctor came in wearing a cooking apron covered in blood stains and it's not Halloween?

How would you like your young child's teacher to look like he just came back from Sturgis and didn't bother to change before stepping foot in the classroom?

How about apartment maintenance wearing a net shirt that clearly shows his nipple ring, with a knife, zip ties and duct tape on a utility belt?

No? Because their inappropriate clothing is uncomfortable?

It's not the shirt. It's the setting. Work settings have a different clothing requirement, tailored for the work being performed. In a customer facing position, where the customer sees the uniform, the proper dress is neutral and calming.
 
Tessa120 said:
It's not the shirt. It's the setting. Work settings have a different clothing requirement, tailored for the work being performed. In a customer facing position, where the customer sees the uniform, the proper dress is neutral and calming.
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This is the heart of the matter. Target wants to be the retailer of choice for ALL Americans, and not create an unwelcoming environment for guests who happen to disagree with a TM's personal politics and a TM's personal opinions about social issues.
 
Nice pair of khakis, clean good fitting plain red polo shirt, very comfortable shoes, look presentable, totally non controversial required clothing sets the stage for guest interaction such as: "good morning, do you carry asparagus in the p-fresh dept"? Let them wear all the political crap they want, you just do your job to the best of your ability, keep your nose clean and keep your politics to yourself, outside the store. Simple, easy and no bullshit.
 
I’m pretty shocked reading through a lot of these comments and feel like quite a few people need to read both Targets public commitment to diversity and inclusion (available on the Target Website -> corporate -> commitments) as well as the recent Cornell statements in the wake of George Floyd’s death/the subsequent protests and recognize the responsibility that we as TMs have in creating and upholding an environment that is welcoming and inclusive for both our guests AND our fellow TM’s.

All the OP would need to say to any guest looking to start “trouble” over a Black Lives Matter shirt is that they are showing solidarity with the Black community (which is a human not political act).

For the record OP, I hope you wore the shirt.
 
spotoff said:
I’m pretty shocked reading through a lot of these comments and feel like quite a few people need to read both Targets public commitment to diversity and inclusion (available on the Target Website -> corporate -> commitments) as well as the recent Cornell statements in the wake of George Floyd’s death/the subsequent protests and recognize the responsibility that we as TMs have in creating and upholding an environment that is welcoming and inclusive for both our guests AND our fellow TM’s.

All the OP would need to say to any guest looking to start “trouble” over a Black Lives Matter shirt is that they are showing solidarity with the Black community (which is a human not political act).

For the record OP, I hope you wore the shirt.
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There is work appropriate and there is non-work appropriate. You check your personality at the door. You check your personal causes at the door. You dress conservatively and in exchange you get paid for conduct, performance and appearance.

Would you go work at Cracker Barrel and insist that they let you sport your new BLM tattoo because it's inclusive? Or do you follow company policy about tattoos in general and cover it up?

Too many people seem to be forgetting that one should present a professional conservative appearance at work, because work is a professional environment.

It has nothing to do with causes or solidarity or inclusion. It has to do with professionalism and having respect that work time is not play time and the appearance and bearing shown in each setting should not cross.
 
redeye58 said:
Reminds me of why we stopped allowing Salvation Army to set up their collection kettles during the holidays.
Aside from the notoriously unreliable kettle folks (frequently trying to leave the kettle at the service desk while they took a break only to never return), leadership said it would open the door for a garden variety of organizations demanding the right to solicit our guests.
Click to expand...
One of the many things I have always appreciated about Target as a company is their "no soliciting" policy.
 
Tessa120 said:
There is work appropriate and there is non-work appropriate. You check your personality at the door. You check your personal causes at the door. You dress conservatively and in exchange you get paid for conduct, performance and appearance.

Would you go work at Cracker Barrel and insist that they let you sport your new BLM tattoo because it's inclusive? Or do you follow company policy about tattoos in general and cover it up?

Too many people seem to be forgetting that one should present a professional conservative appearance at work, because work is a professional environment.

It has nothing to do with causes or solidarity or inclusion. It has to do with professionalism and having respect that work time is not play time and the appearance and bearing shown in each setting should not cross.
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By saying a TM is being paid for appearance you are implicitly saying they could be fired for such, which is discrimination and is illegal.

I think it’s great that you are able to compartmentalize your work and home life, but not all people are able to do so, which is not a flaw just a fact. If you want to check your personality at the door when you get to work, great. that’s your prerogative and you are free to do so. But our team and teams by nature are collective groups comprised of unique Individuals who can and should be able to bring their personality and whole selves to work, and forcing a culture of “conservative professionalism” where we strip people of these things, or worse deem them inappropriate and unprofessional (both of which are your subjective view, not objective fact) is toxic, costly and, in fact, has a huge negative impact on conduct, performance, guest experience, engagement, retention, and the bottom line.

www.google.com

We’re Entering the Age of Corporate Social Justice

The killing of George Floyd by a white police officer in Minneapolis has driven one of the largest protest movements in recent memory, and the widespread reactions to the standard CSR playbook suggest that old best practices may no longer work. The author describes a new model — Corporate Social...
www.google.com www.google.com
 
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While I might agree with a lot of what you said @spotoff I'm also going to hazard a guess you haven’t been on a call with your HRBP specifically asking if anyone at the store is using dress code to make political statements while on the clock? It’s new terrain trying to be Leaders in D&I and honoring our truths while trying to not step on anyone’s toes, be it guest or TM.

I believe our dress code is lax enough to give us plenty of leeway to own our individual look while maintaining enough consistency to have a standard look easily recognizable by our guests.
 
@JAShands I have not. And while I am passionate about politics and believe our society has stifled necessary conversation through a narrowly defined set of times and places in which it is appropriate to have those conversations, I recognize and agree that work, especially a guest facing business, is not an appropriate place for politics or political statements.

But BLM is not political. it’s not unprofessional. its not inappropriate. full stop. it has been politicized, but the distinction between political and politicized is an important one. Masks are a great example of this. And the consequences of assigning it as such, especially in this context, are greater and graver than I think people recognize.
 
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Physical therapists wear work appropriate clothing. Absolutely nothing political. Many doctors and nurses were scrubs, work appropriate clothing. Just put on a nice pair of khakis, a red polo shirt and get to work, do your job, have a nice PB&J in the break room (it's FREE) and cut the bullshit about expression and individualism. Nobody wants to hear it.
 
Your article is about corporate led official statements/acts. It does not support a rogue employee deciding for everyone else what is appropriate.

This is a country of free speech. That means whatever someone says, someone else can say the opposite and gets the same allowance. How many causes do you personally disagree with that you don't want someone advertising through their attire at work?

Another thread, or maybe earlier in this one, I mentioned that if BLM is allowed, then a Confederate shirt would have to be allowed. People flipped out over the thought of someone wearing that. Me as well, I definitely would not want to work alongside someone, but the point is that speech is equal, you can't allow one and not the other. If you don't want to work alongside someone wearing the opposite, that should be a clue that what you are wanting to wear is not what should be at work.

And that's exactly what the ACLU is trying to preserve - free speech. So it's not just a "Murica" cause, it's actually actively being fought for by a very liberal organization. Even when the people working on something hate it, they still work it because free speech must remain sacred.

So, you can't shut up the opposite viewpoint by wanting them banned just for believing the opposite. Two choices, everyone respects neutral, or everyone makes each other uncomfortable while they are captive at work.

Save the politicizing for when you are off the clock. This generation is really the first where I've heard that don't respect a work/life boundary and think that all work time should be treated as private time. Maybe because there's something wrong with deciding that your private choices should be advertised at work as if you really aren't working, as if you're just playing somewhere outside your home. Maybe what works is dressing in an inclusive manner - defined as a manner that does not cause controversy.

And as far as appearance, last I checked many employers don't allow for visible tattoos or non-natural hair colors. That is appearance based hiring and firing. You can't be not hired or fired for skin color, but you can for permanent alterations. Hell, you actually can be not hired or fired for being fat, and that's a big appearance issue.
 
Sometimes stepping outside the box is the only way or the most impactful way to affect change.

While campaign shirts are overtly political and are best avoided, my feeling is things like Pride and Black Lives Matter should not be an issue.
 
spotoff said:
@JAShands I have not. And while I am passionate about politics and believe our society has stifled necessary conversation through a narrowly defined set of times and places in which it is appropriate to have those conversations, I recognize and agree that work, especially a guest facing business, is not an appropriate place for politics or political statements.

But BLM is not political. it’s not unprofessional. its not inappropriate. full stop. it has been politicized, but the distinction between political and politicized is an important one. Masks are a great example of this. And the consequences of assigning it as such, especially in this context, are greater and graver than I think people recognize.
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please check with your store mgt. every store is different.
 
happygoth said:
Sometimes stepping outside the box is the only way or the most impactful way to affect change.

While campaign shirts are overtly political and are best avoided, my feeling is things like Pride and Black Lives Matter should not be an issue.do t
Click to expand...
 
happygoth said:
Sometimes stepping outside the box is the only way or the most impactful way to affect change.

While campaign shirts are overtly political and are best avoided, my feeling is things like Pride and Black Lives Matter should not be an issue.do t
Click to expand...
 
happygoth said:
Sometimes stepping outside the box is the only way or the most impactful way to affect change.

While campaign shirts are overtly political and are best avoided, my feeling is things like Pride and Black Lives Matter should not be an issue.
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So if I wore a WHITE LIVES MATTER shirt you wouldn't get offended?
Solely for the purpose of standing with white solidarity, keeping the white community strong.
Or a BEWARE OF DEMOCRATS shirt?
Because Soo many democrats are ignorant of FACTS, like that Abe Lincoln and the Republicans abolished slavery, and the confederates (democrats) fought to keep slaves, or that democrats created, funded and supported the KKK and Jim Crow Laws.
And the fact Biden/Harris, the House and Senate are both majorally dems and it's only democrats destroying America the past two years!
 
girlwholived said:
I am very political. I know we are allowed to wear any shirt we want as long as we have a vest on I want to wear a black lives matter shirt. Do y’all think they’ll dress code me for this?
Click to expand...
Would you get offended if I wore a WHITE LIVES MATTER shirt?
Solely for the purpose of standing in solidarity with the white community and show strength for the white community?
If you get to wear your shirt, il get to wear mine!
 
Indigo Montoya said:
Would you get offended if I wore a WHITE LIVES MATTER shirt?
Solely for the purpose of standing in solidarity with the white community and show strength for the white community?
If you get to wear your shirt, il get to wear mine!
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This should be fun.
Tell me, my friend, who exactly is the "white community"?
Cause it wasn't the Irish side of my family when the first hit the shores of this country.
They were considered to be as bad as Black people by the white community.
And it sure wasn't (and still isn't to many) the Jewish side of my family.

If you want to be proud of your heritage, let me know what that is.
Did your greats come here from England, Ireland, Sweden, France, Poland...?
That's what it means to be "white", you have heritage from some European country someplace.
You can go look at the records from Ellis Island and see where they came in.

Now ask what country many American Black people's greats came from?
They don't have the kind of records you do.
The ships their greats came over in didn't keep those kinds of records.
Many of them have last names given them by slave owners.
So they have to be a Black Community instead of getting that same history that you have.

Black Lives Matter doesn't mean other lives don't matter, for fucks sake.
It means Black Lives have been routinely treated like second class citizens for far too long.
That it's time to stop doing that.
And just because we stop doing that doesn't mean we are taking rights away from anyone else.

And before you want to start throwing nonsense history at me, just don't.
History is my thing and I will walk over your talking points with pages of truth.
 
commiecorvus said:
Black Lives Matter doesn't mean other lives don't matter, for fucks sake.
It means Black Lives have been routinely treated like second class citizens for far too long.
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THIS. Just by switching a word isn't as simple as the meaning instantly translated! BLM was made BECAUSE of the hate against their group.

Now if you look at something like WLM it represents something else. Yeah there might be hate towards white people but it is miniscule compared to POC. WLM was literally made with the sole purpose of being the opposite of BLM. okay. I'll stop. But if you'd like to continue this convo, i'd be more than happy to continue in the political thread. where this kinda conversation belongs.
 
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