Archived Fiscal cliff impact

[StateofTarget]

Well, my thinking is that I have had decent insurance for decades (PPO or HMO) with Target UP until this national healthcare bill was presented. NOW Target is dropping decent insurance? Seems like Target is saying, let the government take care of them now. Right now, Target subsidizes 80% of the insurance premiums, so when they drop everyone completely, will I be paying for the premiums 100% on my own?

And my being in Cali and my healthcare cost being so high is because we have so many illegal residents here that don't pay for insurance. They just show up at emergency rooms, who can't turn them away legally. They will continue to be illegally paid, and will continue to get free healthcare. National Healthcare is not going to take care of that problem.
Still worth it, I ain't moving anywhere else. LOL!

This wait, you'll see, things are going to be peachy isn't cutting it with me.

Give me exact figures. "TOT, you are going to be paying $xxx every week and $xx every time you see a doctor... " etc. will then give me some peace.

Until then, I'm not drinking the koolaid. LOL!

<sigh> You didn't read half of what I wrote did you?

"Seems like Target is saying, let the government take care of them now"

You are not getting health insurance from the government people! You are getting it *directly from an insurance company* as opposed to *from your employer*. Yes, you can still get insurance from your employers plan - but you will get it from the insurance company direct without the employer being the middle man. Get it? The employer is being kicked out of being the middle man - but you can still get the insurance from your employers plan, but you are able to pay the insurance company direct instead of the employer. This also gives you more choices because you can pick *all of the plans* the insurance company offers instead of the one your *employer picks for you*.

You will only get health insurance from the government if you are completely destitute, have no employer, and can't afford any health care at all. In that case, you get on something called MEDICAID which has existed for decades.

Right now Target is only offering the HSA plan. Target announced way back in 2007 that they would eventually get rid of the PPO/HMO. Anyone with a decent memory will remember this - it was announced at huddles back then as being the plan in future years to let everyone know.

When the new law goes into effect in 2014, you will be able to literally choose from *dozens of different plans*. So if the HSA sucks, guess what? You can actually get the PPO again or the HMO! Again, read about the HEALTH CARE EXCHANGE. In 2014, you can pick any plan you want - not just the one Target picks for you. Like I said, the middle man is getting kicked out. Right now, the employer *makes the choice of what plan you can have for you*. Under the new law, *you get to pick the plan from the insurance company* without Target deciding for you.


Let me give an example since the first one didn't work very well apparently:

Let's pretend you have three people - Tom, Sam, and John. You are Sam. Tom (the insurance company) is selling health insurance. John (the employer) is your big brother who always pushes you around.

Tom has 50 health insurance plans for you to pick from. Tom comes over to your house trying to offer all of these plans for you to pick from.

When Tom comes over, John answers the door, puts Tom in a headlock, and say HE is going to decide what plans Sam (you) can pick from.

John comes over to you and says "Sam, bro, I looked at all these plans and decided the HSA is the only one you can have. Got a problem with that? I'll kick your a**".

What the law does is bring in Vincent. Vincent is a 300 pound 6' 5" boxer. Vincent tells your bully brother to fu** off. Tom then gets to show you all 50 plans and you get to pick for the one YOU think is best for you, not the one John said you had to have.

 

[TargetOldTimer]

Well, maybe since I still have an HMO, I haven't felt your pain.

Will Target continue to contribute 80% of the premium cost?

 

[StateofTarget]

Well, maybe since I still have an HMO, I haven't felt your pain.

Will Target continue to contribute 80% of the premium cost?

Ok, you and everyone else on this thread should watch this 10 minute explanation video because apparently I am not explaining it well enough:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-Ilc5xK2_E

It is an EXCELLENT explanation video that uses lots of examples and has 500,000 views. I strongly recommend it.

Basically the short answer to your question is "yes, but you can't think of it that way anymore".

 

[TargetOldTimer]

Cute cartoon.

 

[Hero4sale85]

I'm going to say this, and I hope I don't get flamed for it. But here is the thing. I live well below the poverty line. I have my own house, my own car, a cell phone, and I pay my own bills. You can argue about where the money is coming from. Is it a tax raise, or a lapse of the stimulus or whatever. Fine but to those of us that live pay check to pay check, it makes a difference. To some of those guest that live pay check to pay check, it makes a difference. And of course, those sales make a difference to Target. And they make a big difference to my store, where we may beat our sales by a couple hundred dollars. When our economy hasn't rebounded yet, it may not be the best idea to take anything additional.

 

[Retail Girl]

And my being in Cali and my healthcare cost being so high is because we have so many illegal residents here that don't pay for insurance. They just show up at emergency rooms, who can't turn them away legally. They will continue to be illegally paid, and will continue to get free healthcare. National Healthcare is not going to take care of that

Until then, I'm not drinking the koolaid. LOL!

No need to drink the koolaid, but no need to buy into myths, either.

http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-article/report-uninsured-emergency-room-use-greatly-exaggerated

 

[GlobalTL123]

This!

I'm going to say this, and I hope I don't get flamed for it. But here is the thing. I live well below the poverty line. I have my own house, my own car, a cell phone, and I pay my own bills. You can argue about where the money is coming from. Is it a tax raise, or a lapse of the stimulus or whatever. Fine but to those of us that live pay check to pay check, it makes a difference. To some of those guest that live pay check to pay check, it makes a difference. And of course, those sales make a difference to Target. And they make a big difference to my store, where we may beat our sales by a couple hundred dollars. When our economy hasn't rebounded yet, it may not be the best idea to take anything additional.

 

[mxrbook]

<sigh>

The provision regulating increase in rates only applies to insurance on the *private market*. In other words, if you go out on your own and buy an individual policy. I.e. you go directly to Humana and buy an insurance policy directly from them just for yourself. (only upper middle class and upper class people i.e. rich people generally do this)

The provision does *not* impact employer rates that they charge to employees through group insurance.

This is how health insurance works right now today (example):

Humana offers multiple group health insurance plans to employers -> Employers like Target look at the plans and decide what plan(s) they want to offer their employees -> Target tells humana they will buy, for example, Plan C -> Target pays Humana $50 million annually to cover all Target employees -> Target then decides how much of that $50 million they will pay and how much they will make TMs pay -> Target collects a monthly premium from TMs to offset the cost.

The provision you are talking about only applies to plans from the insurance company. Under the new health care law, you will be able to get plans *directly from the insurance company*. The law prohibits THOSE premiums from going up without review.

Right now, you are getting health care *from your employer*. (THIS is the major change the health care law is bringing about in 2014 - an end to having to get health insurance from your employer - now you can get it directly from the insurance company) When you pay your monthly health care premium out of your paycheck, that money is not going to the health insurance company. That money is going directly to Target. Guess what? Target is not a health insurance company. Therefore, they are free to require however much money they want from you. The law only applies to health insurance companies.

Let me say this again, you are getting health insurance *from your employer* right now today. This is how it is for everyone in america today. The law is only focused on *letting you get insurance directly from the insurance company*. In other words, *you are no longer dependent on your employer for insurance.*

If you want and bought the same insurance on the open market directly from Humana, for example, it could easily cost you $5000 a month. What Target is doing is basically buying the plan FOR YOU, and then giving it to you at a discounted rate. That is why it is a called a health care BENEFIT. The insurance company DOES NOT control how much money you pay for your monthly premium - your employer does. The insurance company could jack up the plan price from $50 million to $100 million dollars. Or it could drop it from $50 million to $40 million. Or they could leave it exactly the same. It is up to the employer (Target) to decide if they are going to alter the amount of premium they collect from you. That premium goes directly into Target's bank account - not the insurance company. Target already bought the policy for you - they are just collecting money from you to offset their costs of buying it for you to begin with.

The law is radically changing how this works. (Why do you think it was so controversial?) Instead of having to get insurance from your employer, you will be able to go on the open market and get it yourself directly from the insurance company. However, the law drastically changes the rates they can charge you. So instead of the health insurance company charging you $5000 a month like they would do today if you went and a policy directly from them, they now can only charge you $100 a month, for example. OR if you are so poor you can't even afford $100 a month, OR you can't even get it from your employer, you can sign up for medicaid instead in 2014, which is not available to most people today.

Obviously, I am using Target in this example.... but every other company in america uses this same model.

So to summarize - here is how the law changes things:

Today health insurance looks like this:

Humana offers multiple group health insurance plans to employers -> Employers like Target look at the plans and decide what plan(s) they want to offer their employees -> Target tells humana they will buy, for example, Plan C -> Target pays Humana $50 million annually to cover all Target employees -> Target then decides how much of that $50 million they will pay and how much they will make TMs pay -> Target collects a monthly premium from TMs to offset the cost.

Under the new law health insurance looks like this:

Humana offers multiple health plans for you as an individual to pick from -> You pick the plan you want, such as plan B -> You pay Humana directly $30 a month for your plan. That's it. Simple.

OR You can't afford health insurance at all. You go to your states Health and Human Services office and get on medicaid.[/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR]

^^^^^^^^This is what the health care law regulates, not the old (current) employer provided health insurance. That is dying out in 2014 and being replaced with what are called "health care exchanges". Do a google search on "Health Care Exchange" to learn more.

You're wrong on many levels, but I'll start with the biggest concept. Target self-insures. They use a go-between so as not to violate HIPA laws. Nothing you described pertains to Target insurance.

Second, not everyone gets health insurance from their employers.

You are correct in that every increase in rates has to be approved, but due process has been followed and premiums are going up.

Third, you drank the KoolAid.