Well I lost my job this week

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StateofTarget said:
Idiot. What world do you live on? No one died or suffered permanent injury. People fight every day. Guessing you don't go out to bars much?
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He was wrong to grab you. On that we agree. YOU were wrong in punching him. You escalated things. Me? I would have just twisted loose and kept on going. No snarky remarks and no escalation. By doing that I protect my job as I would have done nothing wrong.
 
bikebryan said:
He was wrong to grab you. On that we agree. YOU were wrong in punching him. You escalated things. Me? I would have just twisted loose and kept on going. No snarky remarks and no escalation. By doing that I protect my job as I would have done nothing wrong.
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I would have done the same thing as SOT, and taken the firing in stride. Verbally assault me all you want but the second you touch me all bets are off.
 
bikebryan said:
He was wrong to grab you. On that we agree. YOU were wrong in punching him. You escalated things. Me? I would have just twisted loose and kept on going. No snarky remarks and no escalation. By doing that I protect my job as I would have done nothing wrong.
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Ok, that's fine. You are not obligated to defend yourself. I just hope when and if the day comes when you are physically attacked, your attacker is kind enough not to exploit the fact you won't fight back.
 
The thing is...you were in a...best buy parking lot...not some alley off of 3rd street. Your missing the entire point.
 
OK guys, we can armchair-quarterback this 'til we're blue in the face.
We'd all react differently based on different life experiences. Agree to disagree.
Though it wasn't anybody's business, he told you what happened.
We can all learn something from it & move on.
 
StateofTarget said:
Ok, that's fine. You are not obligated to defend yourself. I just hope when and if the day comes when you are physically attacked, your attacker is kind enough not to exploit the fact you won't fight back.
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Grabbing your arm is worlds different than you punching him in the nose. Don't you get that? You ESCALATED things. I've been grabbed by many people in many situations. Instead of starting a fight, I just shrugged away from them and moved on. They may be guilty of assaulting you, but then you escalated it to battery, maybe even aggravated battery. You were in the wrong just as much, if not more so, than the person who started it.
 
bikebryan said:
Grabbing your arm is worlds different than you punching him in the nose. Don't you get that? You ESCALATED things. I've been grabbed by many people in many situations. Instead of starting a fight, I just shrugged away from them and moved on. They may be guilty of assaulting you, but then you escalated it to battery, maybe even aggravated battery. You were in the wrong just as much, if not more so, than the person who started it.
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Ok dude, what do you think his next action was going to be if we played it your way? Chances are, if I didn't throw the first punch it would have been him.

What you are saying is basically like "The guy grabbed me and pulled a knife on me, but I didn't want to escalate anything by touching him, so I just stood there and let him stab me".

Me standing there and waiting for him to get the first punch is almost as stupid as standing there and waiting for someone to stab you. The point the guy touched me, it was obvious what his intentions were. He was also in a complete mad rage. If I would have just tried to push him off me, you know what his next move would have been? He would have gotten the first punch in. Or do you really think when I pushed him off me he wouldn't come back at me more aggressively? Get real dude. The moment I pushed him off me he would have come back swinging.

Here is how it works 99.9% of the time once someone grabs you in the following order:

1. Person grabs you.
2. You push them to get them off.
3. Push results in a fist coming at your face.

I chose to skip step 2 and went directly to step 3 so that it was my fist coming to his face instead of his fist coming to mine.

You are saying I should have just stood there and took the first punch? Hell with that. If someone wants to fight me, I am going in to win. That means the moment they touch me, they no longer have the assumption of "maybe they won't take things further". The point he touched me was a non-verbal way of saying "Hey, I am making this physical from this point on". From that point, if I can get the first punch, damn right I am going to take it because letting him take the first swing puts me at huge disadvantage. The moment someone touches you, that is them saying that the matter is physical from that point. You can't just "push them off" and have them walk away at that point. They are going to be coming at you whether you like it or not.

In case you missed what happened before this point, BTW, the dude followed me from inside the store out to the parking lot in a mad rage. He then put hands on me in the parking lot. Do you really believe, considering the dude followed me that far out of the store, he was just going to suddenly back off and go back inside the store and forget the matter? I tried walking away - it resulted in hands being put on me. The dude was not going to allow me to "push him off" and let me go on my way. He wanted a fight and he got one.
 
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kingpin003 said:
Why are you so convinced you were about to get stabbed?
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<sigh> It was a hypothetical example to illustrate how ridiculous the idea of standing around waiting for someone to hit you first is. I was trying to say that if someone had a knife, would you just stand there and wait to see if he stabs you because you didn't want to "escalate" the situation? Of course not. That would be idiotic. Well, instead of a knife this guy had a fist. It would be equally idiotic to stand around waiting to get punched.
 
If the story from SOT is legit, they're obviously both wrong. I'd say the Best Buy manager was more wrong, but SOT has got to know he needs to value his job more enough to just deal with getting grabbed. It would have been sweeter getting the manager fired and you still worked for Sony.
 
bikebryan said:
Grabbing your arm is worlds different than you punching him in the nose. Don't you get that? You ESCALATED things.
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My first reaction upon someone grabbing my arm would be to immediately punch them in the face. It's happened before and it will happen again. Gut reactions take precedence over thinking about some job that can always be replaced. I value my personal security over some stupid ****ing retail job.
 
bikebryan said:
Grabbing your arm is worlds different than you punching him in the nose. Don't you get that? You ESCALATED things. I've been grabbed by many people in many situations. Instead of starting a fight, I just shrugged away from them and moved on. They may be guilty of assaulting you, but then you escalated it to battery, maybe even aggravated battery. You were in the wrong just as much, if not more so, than the person who started it.
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I'm going to quote this entire post and say you'd rather lay down like a ***** and take a beating, than stand up and defend yourself? You're what's wrong with the world. You're a ****ing pussy. Stand up and defend yourself or be stomped on forever, you *****. Grow some balls and stand up like a man. Unless of course you're a masochist and want to be beaten and stomped on like you're someone's plaything.
 
pzychopopgroove said:
I'm going to quote this entire post and say you'd rather lay down like a ***** and take a beating, than stand up and defend yourself? You're what's wrong with the world. You're a ****ing pussy. Stand up and defend yourself or be stomped on forever, you *****. Grow some balls and stand up like a man. Unless of course you're a masochist and want to be beaten and stomped on like you're someone's plaything.
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You dont always have to throw hands with every person that crosses your path.
 
How we react to things depends on many life experiences. If you live on the South side of Chicago and someone has followed you out of a store it is very likely that the confrontation will end up with some sort of violence. If you live in the middle of Kansas and someone follows you out of a store the confrontation may be totally different than Chicago.

We can't make judgements. What we think we would do and what we would do may be two different things. Of course, we'd all like to say that we would walk away....but given the circumstances I'm guessing that many of us wouldn't.

The fact is, we don't know what we'd do because we weren't there. Personally, I'm glad that I wasn't there. We all make quick decisions. Sometimes we're right....sometimes we're wrong. Sometimes we don't know if we did the right thing.


Now, I don't agree with the idea that being grabbed must end with some type of violence.....it could, but I'd hope not.
Remember, there have been a few great examples of non-violence and walking away......Mahatma Gandhi.....Martin Luther King, Jr., Jesus.... Today, we have a whole religious group, the Amish, that don't believe in violence. They continue to thrive in their communities.
 
StateofTarget said:
It was not even a big deal.

Basically I was at a best buy doing my job. I will tell you right now that best buy managers are probably the worst, and I feel sorry for anyone who works there having to deal with best buy managers. The vast majority of them are on power trips and talk down to people. Anyway, I was only at the store to do a content change on the PS3. I was planning a few minutes to be there. Some twerp best buy manager comes over to me (looked about 22 years old) and immediately said something like "Hey, I need you to get our Xbox display working before you go and I need it done before you do what you are doing to the PS3". I told him straight up we don't touch other companies products period. Then he said something like "Uh, look, you just need to do it and if you don't get it done I'll need sony's contact info from you". I had just finished the content change and I said something like "Well I'm done here. Cya" I literally pulled out my managers business card and put it in his hand and told him what hours my manager takes calls.

I start walking off and I hear the idiot from behind me say "Hey, get back here". I just kept walking and the idiot kept following me telling me to come back. So I just keep completely ignoring him, and I can hear the dude behind me basically raging on a massive power trip telling me idiotic **** like "I'M A MANAGER HERE, YOU LISTEN AND DO WHAT I SAY". I'm sure that **** works on his employees, but he has zero authority over me. He was basically one of those managers who constantly thinks he is a god, has his employees fear him, and didn't know what to do when someone treated him like the joke that he was.

So by this point I am out in the parking lot and the dumb ass is still following me out to my car. All of a sudden I hear him say "Hey you f***er you do what I say" and the dude grabs my arm and spins me around. Without even thinking about it I punch the idiot straight in his face. From that point a minor fight broke out. There was a cop in the parking lot, and we were arrested probably 45 seconds after it started. Like I said, not even a big deal. Though I did manage to fu** him up in those 45 seconds.
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I noted from what you said this particular point you made because it was the exact reason you were fired: You hit him first. From a company's standpoint you must be professional first and foremost. This is at least what management is going to go by. On the street laying someone out because they touched you may make you a man, but at a job it keeps you unemployed. I don't think customers would feel safe knowing that every fifteen seconds someone is knocking someone out over a touch on the shoulder.

I am a rather big guy and I often get pushed emotionally (purposefully I think) to where I would probably do what you just did. Had I in a few situations I've had at Target done what you did, I would literally be unable to pay my bills. I'm sure for some of you who think this is cool that I am the b**** and he's in the right, but so what? I'm not in this world to live up to a fairytale idea of manhood.

This is about survival.

If you want to live, get a job better than Target or a job out of retail. If you want to survive, stay in retail.

The people you mostly work for or with don't have the people skills. Some of them do, but they are far and few between and tend to leave these kinds of jobs post haste. The ones that stay are the angry ones, the ones who feel so ready to blow a stack that they use singular minor stupid instances like this to lash out.

Anyhow, just learn from this and move on.
 
pzychopopgroove said:
I'm going to quote this entire post and say you'd rather lay down like a ***** and take a beating, than stand up and defend yourself? You're what's wrong with the world. You're a ****ing pussy. Stand up and defend yourself or be stomped on forever, you *****. Grow some balls and stand up like a man. Unless of course you're a masochist and want to be beaten and stomped on like you're someone's plaything.
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No. What's wrong with the world is your and SOT's attitude. S others before they S me. Truthfully I HAVE been in this situation. More than once. EVERY time I was able to walk away with not a scratch on me or the other party AND had calmed them down. EVERY SINGLE TIME. Why? Because I decided to be the better man. I'm not a reactionist person who lets raw emotion control me. I don't call others names because I think they are wrong either. My answer to you and SOT is that you need to grow up, and maybe shed some of your balls.
 
pzychopopgroove said:
My first reaction upon someone grabbing my arm would be to immediately punch them in the face. It's happened before and it will happen again. Gut reactions take precedence over thinking about some job that can always be replaced. I value my personal security over some stupid ****ing retail job.
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You better hope it's never a cop or someone tougher than you.
 
bikebryan said:
No. What's wrong with the world is your and SOT's attitude. S others before they S me. Truthfully I HAVE been in this situation. More than once. EVERY time I was able to walk away with not a scratch on me or the other party AND had calmed them down. EVERY SINGLE TIME. Why? Because I decided to be the better man. I'm not a reactionist person who lets raw emotion control me. I don't call others names because I think they are wrong either. My answer to you and SOT is that you need to grow up, and maybe shed some of your balls.
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That's because you're a man with experience.
 
bikebryan said:
No. What's wrong with the world is your and SOT's attitude. S others before they S me. Truthfully I HAVE been in this situation. More than once. EVERY time I was able to walk away with not a scratch on me or the other party AND had calmed them down. EVERY SINGLE TIME. Why? Because I decided to be the better man. I'm not a reactionist person who lets raw emotion control me. I don't call others names because I think they are wrong either. My answer to you and SOT is that you need to grow up, and maybe shed some of your balls.
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You're right on point with almost the whole comment. The thing that these people need to realize though that it isn't just "shedding balls" in exchange for nothing--it's trading balls for BRAINS, something that seems to be in short supply for them. Some people in this world need to realize that the biggest man, the man who punches the hardest or the most often, is almost uniformly the WORST man, not the BEST.
 
I'm going to lock this thread now as it has run it's course and served it's purpose.

I will take this opportunity to speak on something though. I do not find it to anyone's benefit when people use the limited confines of a forum environment to micro-analyze someone else's life. We can argue the individual's acts as much as we want, but at the end of the day we can't say exactly how we would respond in the same situation. We can say how we would like to behave, how we would like to react or how we have acted in a similar situation, but beyond that we are merely offering hypotheticals to a specific instance that we ourselves were not at. Everyone is free to call out someone's actions as they see it up until they start to see that individual solely based on one act that they felt like sharing with the community here. Please keep things civil. I do encourage each of you to speak up though, voice your opinions, debate an issue, but at the end of the day remember that you came here to be part of a community and that means having an understanding that we all need to work at getting along.

Again, this thread has run it's course, but I'm not trying to stop the "idea" that has carried on here. If you want to create a thread about "How to handle a combative guest" or some such topic, be my guest. .... just keep it civil, OK?
 
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