wages

[happygoth]

In the old days people rose up and used guillotines to deal with these kinds of problems.
Is that what you have in mind, because I really don't see you providing other options.

I don't think a revolution is needed here, lol. Target does ok taking care of its employees. It may not be the best company ever, but it's by far not the worst.

 

[happygoth]

I'm sorry, I hate it when my references are too obscure for people.
After all the French Revolution and the people rising up against the rich was a long time ago.
Have to work on that and do better.


More recently, when my grandfather was a young man, they organized into hardcore unions and fought the companies.
And I do mean fought, like with bullets and bombs.
The companies hired thugs to shoot you for organizing and dropped dynamite into peoples homes.

Just letting the company shove what they want to down your throat is not how this works.
Fighting back is the way America works.

If anyone thinks working for Target is akin to what the French suffered leading up to the Revolution or what some folks went through as the impetus to create unions, than holy crap have we gone soft. Target is paradise compared to the working conditions some have endured and continue to endure. Let's get some perspective here.

 

[seasonaldude]

If anyone thinks working for Target is akin to what the French suffered leading up to the Revolution or what some folks went through as the impetus to create unions, than holy crap have we gone soft. Target is paradise compared to the working conditions some have endured and continue to endure. Let's get some perspective here.

No, Target is not the worst. But revolution isn't just for Target employees. It would be to liberate all comrades everywhere. Internationalism is a basic tenet of most flavors of socialism. As Marx wrote: Workers of the world, unite! You have nothing to lose but your chains!

 

[Ashfromoldsite]

Seriously?

He has been working hard for the company for more than a decade and he is making the starting wage for people off the street.
For this you want him to be grateful?
WTAF?

$15.00 an hour is not enough to rent a 2 bedroom apartment in most major cities in this country.
There's a reason the states you listed and a number of cities including Seattle have $15.00 as the minimum wage.
It was what I was making as a lead chef in 1991.
Thirty years later and you are supposed to be grateful for that?
I don't fucking think so.

As to finding another job, why do you think so many restaurants and retail stores are having such a hard time finding people?
Could it be that people are tired of making survival wages and barely surviving at that?

It’s the way things have been done for DECADES. These raises started affecting me in the early 90s when minimum wage was $3.35.
because it has affected me at LEAST a dozen times, I agree…be grateful and get over it. It WILL happen again and again and again.

 

[happygoth]

No, Target is not the worst. But revolution isn't just for Target employees. It would be to liberate all comrades everywhere. Internationalism is a basic tenet of most flavors of socialism. As Marx wrote: Workers of the world, unite! You have nothing to lose but your chains!

Lol. The United States will never become a Socialist country and thank goodness for that.

But y'all keep dreaming.

 

[commiecorvus]

Lol. The United States will never become a Socialist country and thank goodness for that.

But y'all keep dreaming.

I think you might be surprised how much things are going to change over the next 30 years.
It won't be any of the basic seven forms of socialism but it will be much closer than what we have now.
It will be similar to making Damascus steel where you heat together layers of two very different kinds of metal and then beat the hell out of them to make something that works beautifully.

Right now we are going through a major upheaval of late stage capitalism.
The fact that so many countries are able to measurably better standards with things like National Health Care etc. is going to cause some serious uprisings.
When you have the richest men in the world shooting dicks into space instead of making an attempt to solve real world problems then you can see why people will be going out to make changes.

There will be a time when AOC and Bernie won't be considered to be on the fringe anymore.
They will be the center, like their politics are in 70% of the rest of the world.

 

[Rarejem]

I think you might be surprised how much things are going to change over the next 30 years.
It won't be any of the basic seven forms of socialism but it will be much closer than what we have now.
It will be similar to making Damascus steel where you heat together layers of two very different kinds of metal and then beat the hell out of them to make something that works beautifully.

Right now we are going through a major upheaval of late stage capitalism.
The fact that so many countries are able to measurably better standards with things like National Health Care etc. is going to cause some serious uprisings.
When you have the richest men in the world shooting dicks into space instead of making an attempt to solve real world problems then you can see why people will be going out to make changes.

There will be a time when AOC and Bernie won't be considered to be on the fringe anymore.
They will be the center, like their politics are in 70% of the rest of the world.

I live in an area in which many of our parks and streets are named for elected Socialist government officials. It actually works. Those officials retired... they were not voted out of office and their influence and legacy is still apparent in the community and surrounding areas.

 

[happygoth]

I think you might be surprised how much things are going to change over the next 30 years.
It won't be any of the basic seven forms of socialism but it will be much closer than what we have now.
It will be similar to making Damascus steel where you heat together layers of two very different kinds of metal and then beat the hell out of them to make something that works beautifully.

Right now we are going through a major upheaval of late stage capitalism.
The fact that so many countries are able to measurably better standards with things like National Health Care etc. is going to cause some serious uprisings.
When you have the richest men in the world shooting dicks into space instead of making an attempt to solve real world problems then you can see why people will be going out to make changes.

There will be a time when AOC and Bernie won't be considered to be on the fringe anymore.
They will be the center, like their politics are in 70% of the rest of the world.

I don't see that happening. The divide in this country is too great for Socialist policies to gain footing, at least not on a national level. Almost everyone I know thinks Bernie is at best a dreamer and AOC is crazy.

 

[IhateOPmodel]

I think you might be surprised how much things are going to change over the next 30 years.
It won't be any of the basic seven forms of socialism but it will be much closer than what we have now.
It will be similar to making Damascus steel where you heat together layers of two very different kinds of metal and then beat the hell out of them to make something that works beautifully.

Right now we are going through a major upheaval of late stage capitalism.
The fact that so many countries are able to measurably better standards with things like National Health Care etc. is going to cause some serious uprisings.
When you have the richest men in the world shooting dicks into space instead of making an attempt to solve real world problems then you can see why people will be going out to make changes.

There will be a time when AOC and Bernie won't be considered to be on the fringe anymore.
They will be the center, like their politics are in 70% of the rest of the world.

National health care isn't all it's cracked up to be, it isn't free and in Canada, the country in which I hear everyone wish our healthcare system was like, is expensive and hard to get a timely appointment. They just disguise their healthcare costs in taxes. The average Canadian pays $6k a year or more in health care taxes. I don't know about you but I don't pay nearly that much for a family of 3. The grass isn't always greener and I definitely don't think socialism is the answer. Everyone wants everything for free and don't realize that nothing in life is free.

You can hate Jeff Bezos all you want and I think he is a major tool as well but he built his company from the ground up and I'm sure as some point had to work hard to get it going. Now he is sitting back and reaping the benefits, in my opinion there is nothing wrong with that. The great thing about America is if you work hard enough you can make any dream of yours come true, even if that dream is to launch a giant penis rocket into "space".

 

[commiecorvus]

National health care isn't all it's cracked up to be, it isn't free and in Canada, the country in which I hear everyone wish our healthcare system was like, is expensive and hard to get a timely appointment. They just disguise their healthcare costs in taxes. The average Canadian pays $6k a year or more in health care taxes. I don't know about you but I don't pay nearly that much for a family of 3. The grass isn't always greener and I definitely don't think socialism is the answer. Everyone wants everything for free and don't realize that nothing in life is free.

You can hate Jeff Bezos all you want and I think he is a major tool as well but he built his company from the ground up and I'm sure as some point had to work hard to get it going. Now he is sitting back and reaping the benefits, in my opinion there is nothing wrong with that. The great thing about America is if you work hard enough you can make any dream of yours come true, even if that dream is to launch a giant penis rocket into "space".

Bezos didn't build his company from the ground up.
He did it with a huge fucking chunk of money from his parents and then a whole bunch of other people's money.
He also put a bunch of companies out of business in the process.
Including Borders, where I was working at the time.
He doesn't pay taxes and uses the postal service to deliver his product.
He owes this country in a big way.
Bezos is everything wrong with the US.
He is the new generation of robber baron, look up the term if you don't know what I'm talking about.
We did great as a country when we had a 90% tax rate for millionaires.
Time to go back to that

As to health care, there are no countries that have universal healthcare that would trade it for the nightmare we have.
Yes, Canadians are taxed to cover the cost of their healthcare but overall they pay less than we do.
And there isn't the constant dinging for copays and deductibles.
The only times there are long waits is for elective surgery.
A friend of mine was diagnosed with skin cancer and was taken in to have it removed that same day.

So, don't believe the scare tactics of the right about health care.
The rich and powerful want you to be cowering but you don't have to be.
Stand up and fight back.
The only thing you have to lose is your chains.

 

[IhateOPmodel]

Bezos didn't build his company from the ground up.
He did it with a huge fucking chunk of money from his parents and then a whole bunch of other people's money.
He also put a bunch of companies out of business in the process.
Including Borders, where I was working at the time.
He doesn't pay taxes and uses the postal service to deliver his product.
He owes this country in a big way.
Bezos is everything wrong with the US.
He is the new generation of robber baron, look up the term if you don't know what I'm talking about.
We did great as a country when we had a 90% tax rate for millionaires.
Time to go back to that

As to health care, there are no countries that have universal healthcare that would trade it for the nightmare we have.
Yes, Canadians are taxed to cover the cost of their healthcare but overall they pay less than we do.
And there isn't the constant dinging for copays and deductibles.
The only times there are long waits is for elective surgery.
A friend of mine was diagnosed with skin cancer and was taken in to have it removed that same day.

So, don't believe the scare tactics of the right about health care.
The rich and powerful want you to be cowering but you don't have to be.
Stand up and fight back.
The only thing you have to lose is your chains.

Jeff Bezos built his company with money from his family, along with countless other large and small businesses in the world. I'm sure the people who loaned Bezos money or invested early on in Amazon are pretty happy right now. What would you like to happen someone who starts a small business to stop making money at a certain point? Stop being ambitious and stop trying to grow their company? And for Borders I'm sure it wasn't Amazon that only took them down, I see that Barnes and Noble which is basically the same thing is still up and running. It's no one's fault but Borders that they are out of business, they couldn't keep up or compete and they got squeezed out by companies who were ahead of the curve and adapted to a changing world. And if Bezos isn't paying taxes or finding away around the system by a loop hole, don't be mad at him because according to the government what he is doing isn't illegal or else he'd be in alot of trouble. Be mad at the government. Which I'm sure you are.

I'm not scared about healthcare or cowering for anything or anyone. I just don't think the grass is greener, it's just different grass. I've talked to family and friends who live in Canada and it isn't as awesome as some think it is.

 

[Zxy123456]

What do you think they should be making? $20 an hour?! They can't pay everyone $20 an hour to be a cashier or to stock shelves. These aren't specialty job, no schooling or anything is required. Target is on par with every equal job out there.

Do you want to pay $10 for a gallon of milk? Or $5 for a loaf of bread? 12 years ago minimum wage at target was $7.75 and now that is basically minimum wage in my state. I get times are tough but they can't go and make adjustments for all the team members. They are doing what's best for them and their share holders which in the long run is all they care about.

I delivered merit increases 2 years in a row where basically veteran team members were getting $.25 and newer team members were getting a dollar or so. I get it sucks but I didn't have a single team member that didn't get an increase in pay during that time and I'm sure there weren't many that didn't.

I don’t think $20 is necessary but, definitely should be making more than a newbie even if it was $15.25 or $15.50. Amount doesn’t matter as long as someone with 15 years makes more than someone new. I think that’s the point original poster was trying to make!! I got ten years in and feel I deserve more than a newbie. Thankfully with my last raise I do make a little more than a newbie.

 

[Zxy123456]

Target just wants bodies, so they currently value newer hires more than long term. its all about the numbers, quantity over quality. otherwise why would a new hire sign on bonus be 10 times the 25 year service award. Because bringing new people in the door takes priority over everything, including taking care of their current teams.

What sign on bonus maybe at Dc but a stores newbies don’t get a sign on bonus.

 

[Zxy123456]

Work in the stores? You got it made...take the $15 and be quiet. Take advantage of the new education money and get into a program that will get a new higher paying position.

We do not have it made have you ever worked in a store I can guarantee we do not have it made!! Yesterday I worked almost 9 hours on drive up out in the heat and humidity!! I’m not complaining just stating we do not have it made. Original poster mentioned they are on truck unload I know those peeps do not have it made.

 

[FlowTeamChick]

After some of the comments @IhateOPmodel made about vaccine mandates (let's not rehash that here), imagine my surprise to find myself agreeing with much of what they say about economic systems.
Some comments: No, to answer the OP's question, it isn't fair that someone with a decade of experience should make the same as a brand new hire. However, back when the $15 by 2020 (or whatever it was) was first announced, I was flat out told by an ETL that, as far as Target is concerned, experience and longevity mean nothing. That's almost a direct quote. To say I was shocked is an understatement, considering that every single job I've ever had valued experience if not longevity. So, suck it up, buttercup, just like the rest of us who stayed anyway.
When I was in high school many years ago, my family lived in Florida where a required class was Americanism vs. Communism (Cuba is about 80 miles away and the Iron Curtain was still very much in place as was the Cold War with the USSR). As a form of government, communism at its ideal would be great - everyone works as they are able and is given what they need. Our teacher would rather often ask us, "Why will it never work?" And the answer is, "Human nature." Even if not actually greedy, people are naturally selfish. We have to be taught to share our toys, to not take the biggest piece of cake, to not cut in line, etc. Unless a person has a strong altruistic bent or has strong community ties, we have a tendency to "take care of our own" first and sometimes only.
Socialism is a notch away from that, but it'll never work in this country, partly for the same reason. Added to that is that we aren't generally very trusting of our government; we can't even trust health care professionals telling us how to prevent the spread of a serious, sometimes fatal, disease. (I'm fully vaccinated and glad for it, plus I never stopped masking up, even when we were told it was okay to go unmasked.) Successful socialism requires a high degree of trust, both in government to spend tax dollars wisely and in our fellow citizens to not take undue advantage.
A good example is how *everyone* points to the Nordic countries and says it's so great - very high taxes that pay for a fairly wide social safety net. And it is pretty good for many of those who live there, but those countries are very different from the U.S. in quite a few ways. Even so, it isn't great for everyone there.
All that said, we definitely could learn from what works well in other countries and implement revised forms of some of it here. Our tax code needs a major overhaul so the very wealthy pay their fair share instead of using legal loopholes to pay nothing. Our health care system really doesn't work very well at keeping people healthy as well as it works for making some companies very rich. The pay inequity between company owners and the workers keeps increasing. Too many people distrust institutions like government and churches, and rightly so in some cases when there are news stories practically every day about corruption.
The problems are so large that it seems that no one really knows how to fix them or even where to start. And now that I've made myself feel depressed, I'm going to get some yard work done. What my weedy, overgrown front yard & garden look like IS something I can change. 😉

 

[IhateOPmodel]

We do not have it made have you ever worked in a store I can guarantee we do not have it made!! Yesterday I worked almost 9 hours on drive up out in the heat and humidity!! I’m not complaining just stating we do not have it made. Original poster mentioned they are on truck unload I know those peeps do not have it made.

You don't have it made? Do you have a job? Do you get a consistent paycheck on time every 2 weeks? Do you have the opportunity to work toward a yearly merit increase based on your performance? These are all things some people aren't lucky enough to have.

You worked 9 hours in one day? I know people in my store who would kill to have a 9 hour shift! In the heat and humidity?! Seriously? Did you agree to work in drive up? Did you not think it would be hot and humid in your area? How would you like Target to better accommodate you? Put an air conditioned bubble over your store? Find a job, any job in the whole world that doesn't have downfalls or things that are ideal. You will never find one ever.

I remember back in the day I was a manager who had to deliver 5 cent raises to everyone no matter how good they were. The next year no raises because the company was in financial trouble. That was embarrassing for me and I didn't get a raise either year. It sucked but I had a job and I eventually got out of that job and found something better.

However bad you think you have it, I'm sure someone has it worse than you. Don't be so soft.

 

[Zxy123456]

You don't have it made? Do you have a job? Do you get a consistent paycheck on time every 2 weeks? Do you have the opportunity to work toward a yearly merit increase based on your performance? These are all things some people aren't lucky enough to have.

You worked 9 hours in one day? I know people in my store who would kill to have a 9 hour shift! In the heat and humidity?! Seriously? Did you agree to work in drive up? Did you not think it would be hot and humid in your area? How would you like Target to better accommodate you? Put an air conditioned bubble over your store? Find a job, any job in the whole world that doesn't have downfalls or things that are ideal. You will never find one ever.

I remember back in the day I was a manager who had to deliver 5 cent raises to everyone no matter how good they were. The next year no raises because the company was in financial trouble. That was embarrassing for me and I didn't get a raise either year. It sucked but I had a job and I eventually got out of that job and found something better.

However bad you think you have it, I'm sure someone has it worse than you. Don't be so soft.

I am not complaining or being soft but, however we do not have it made as you say. The ones who chose not to work but are somehow sitting home collecting a check those people have it made. Yes I know some people have disabilities or other legitimate reasons they cannot work but, a large number have no excuse.I very much appreciate and enjoy my job I just don’t appreciate someone telling me I have it made. I work hard for everything I have and I definitely do not have it made!! Until you’ve walked a mile in my shoes you have no right to say I have it made!! I guarantee if you did a few drive up shifts in the south in August you would not say I have it made!! Lastly at my store we are so short staffed we have plenty of hours to give if, your fellow Team members want hours send up to my store we will gladly take them. Have a nice day.

 

[IhateOPmodel]

I am not complaining or being soft but, however we do not have it made as you say. The ones who chose not to work but are somehow sitting home collecting a check those people have it made. Yes I know some people have disabilities or other legitimate reasons they cannot work but, a large number have no excuse.I very much appreciate and enjoy my job I just don’t appreciate someone telling me I have it made. I work hard for everything I have and I definitely do not have it made!! Until you’ve walked a mile in my shoes you have no right to say I have it made!! I guarantee if you did a few drive up shifts in the south in August you would not say I have it made!! Lastly at my store we are so short staffed we have plenty of hours to give if, your fellow Team members want hours send up to my store we will gladly take them. Have a nice day.

The people sitting at home who are perfectly well and able to work and collecting unemployment do not have it made, they are losers.

 

[DC Diva]

I don't see that happening. The divide in this country is too great for Socialist policies to gain footing, at least not on a national level. Almost everyone I know thinks Bernie is at best a dreamer and AOC is crazy.

All we are asking is that Target take care of its teams, in a manner that fairly takes into consideration tenure, effort, and overall performance. Not everyone is equal, and not every deserves the same.

 

[60SecondsRemaining]

I think you might be surprised how much things are going to change over the next 30 years.
It won't be any of the basic seven forms of socialism but it will be much closer than what we have now.
It will be similar to making Damascus steel where you heat together layers of two very different kinds of metal and then beat the hell out of them to make something that works beautifully.

Right now we are going through a major upheaval of late stage capitalism.
The fact that so many countries are able to measurably better standards with things like National Health Care etc. is going to cause some serious uprisings.
When you have the richest men in the world shooting dicks into space instead of making an attempt to solve real world problems then you can see why people will be going out to make changes.

There will be a time when AOC and Bernie won't be considered to be on the fringe anymore.
They will be the center, like their politics are in 70% of the rest of the world.

Not that I'm really a big believer in socialism - but the specific flavor of socialism people like AOC and Bernie are pushing for isn't really even socialism. It's just normal policy in most advanced nations.

If you took AOC and Bernie and stuck them in any one of the first world European countries like Germany, Finland, Sweden, etc, they wouldn't even be fringe. Hell they wouldn't even be on the left. That's how far US politics are from the rest of the world.

 

[Far from newbie]

I have many years experience - I am paid the same as my peers.
I do not mind.

After all, the coin could be flipped, they could say “why should I get MORE than them ?”
We do the same tasks, have the same responsibilities and work the same number of hours.

Yes, it’s true, there are a FEW more things that I KNOW that they have yet to learn - but most of what I did in the past is obsolete - some things are no longer done (like rain checks and OOS item substitutes !) and the processes that are the same are performed differently now So we both had to learn the new way.

I don’t feel I am worth much more than a new TM Because of my longevity. My only added value may be that I can TRAIN someone new - once i have done that, we are equal And the expectations set for us are the same.

It’s the SAME job on day 5 as on day 500. The JOB only pays so much.

I am grateful to like what I do. Seniority gets me benefits like a bigger 401K, more vacation time, somewhat of a better schedule and a bit more respect from the team for sticking it out this long and knowing our stores history from the beginning. A few extra dollars is not worth making an issue. Time has taught me comparing/complaining or making waves will only hurt ME.

 

[Rastaman]

Update your resume and start looking for another job. You've spent 10-11 years working for a Fortune 50 company and have acquired skills other employers are looking for. It may take a couple months but you will find something better and less stressful.

You can make more money somewhere else!! Not by staying at Target.

 

[Far from newbie]

Update your resume and start looking for another job. You've spent 10-11 years working for a Fortune 50 company and have acquired skills other employers are looking for. It may take a couple months but you will find something better and less stressful.

You can make more money somewhere else!! Not by staying at Target.

15 years - Simply, it’s NOT always about money - I am comfortable at Target / I am a bit uncomfortable with change
Target has been good to me - unless situation or position gets dramatically worse - I am retiring with Target.

I would leave if :
-Stress increased
-Position was forced to change to Starbucks or Closing TL - those two are a hard NO for me
-vaccine was mandated (I’m stubborn - no one MAKES me do anything)
-management change that was unbearable (good for now but I know it can happen - there are some people you just can NOT work with)

 

[60SecondsRemaining]

-vaccine was mandated (I’m stubborn - no one MAKES me do anything)

Ah yes. You contemplate this while driving to work from your home on which you pay mandated taxes, in your car which you must have your mandated driver's license to operate, wearing your mandated uniform of red and khaki, at the mandated time they placed on the schedule for you to come in.

But you bend to no one.

 

[Far from newbie]

Ah yes. You contemplate this while driving to work from your home on which you pay mandated taxes, in your car which you must have your mandated driver's license to operate, wearing your mandated uniform of red and khaki, at the mandated time they placed on the schedule for you to come in.

But you bend to no one.

I’m not saying I follow NO rules/laws/mandates - I am civil. I’ll pick and choose my battles, make my own decisions, follow the enforcements I agree with, I’m just saying I draw a line without following everything blindly