Archived Why are bosses clueless?

[Bosch]

My favorite is - We don't complete enough of the drastic count during the week.

So on the weekends we make sure to leave our last hour so we can turn off the radio and work on it.

Gets stopped by the STL to teach the newbie in electronics how to merch clearance. With 20 min left in my shift, and I still hadn't been able to get to the drastic count, being stuck on a register for an hour will put a crimp in your plans. Five cashier call outs will cause lines to be long.

And since it was so busy the electronics newbie never had the chance to even look at the clearance. So I had to push it.

Given a coaching for not completing the drastic count report on Monday.. It was a hostile meeting...

Which begs the question ... Did you receive an actual coaching? And I know it's hard to tell sometimes. Some tl's and others like to obscure the fact it's a coaching.

That would be a no, when I suggested they might want to talk with the 8(5 cashier and 3 others) people who called out on Saturday and that is a very common number to call out on a weekend day. When 40+hrs of people call out on a Saturday those of us who do come to work get a bit frustrated when they are given tasks when all you can do is put out fires. At one point I had three pulls on the floor, pets, chem, and HBA since they are close and a ETL kept complaining that there were pulls on the line, so that shut them up, never noticing that there wasn't really anyone actually pushing them. Electronics opener walked off to go to lunch since his coverage was stuck on a register. And he was not going to hit compliance. Great day!

 

[Retail Girl]

My favorite is - We don't complete enough of the drastic count during the week.

So on the weekends we make sure to leave our last hour so we can turn off the radio and work on it.

Gets stopped by the STL to teach the newbie in electronics how to merch clearance. With 20 min left in my shift, and I still hadn't been able to get to the drastic count, being stuck on a register for an hour will put a crimp in your plans. Five cashier call outs will cause lines to be long.

And since it was so busy the electronics newbie never had the chance to even look at the clearance. So I had to push it.

Given a coaching for not completing the drastic count report on Monday.. It was a hostile meeting...

Which begs the question ... Did you receive an actual coaching? And I know it's hard to tell sometimes. Some tl's and others like to obscure the fact it's a coaching.

That would be a no, when I suggested they might want to talk with the 8(5 cashier and 3 others) people who called out on Saturday and that is a very common number to call out on a weekend day. When 40+hrs of people call out on a Saturday those of us who do come to work get a bit frustrated when they are given tasks when all you can do is put out fires. At one point I had three pulls on the floor, pets, chem, and HBA since they are close and a ETL kept complaining that there were pulls on the line, so that shut them up, never noticing that there wasn't really anyone actually pushing them. Electronics opener walked off to go to lunch since his coverage was stuck on a register. And he was not going to hit compliance. Great day!

The frustrating part is that you might have gotten the coaching and they just didn't tell you. Since you don't have to sign anything and the form specifically says the TM is not allowed to see it, and they don't have to call it a coaching to be a coaching, they can document whatever the hell they want and never tell you until it's too late.

I feel you on the call offs, though. It just amazes me when half the damn store calls out, those of us who we left have to put out the fires, but we are the ones that get held responsible in the end...not the ones who decided not to come in,

 

[Bosch]

I don't care at this point, fire me. I will not stress out cause your problem should be the fire I need to put out NOW!

We have been given the speech if you don't like it leave. I just might take you up on it, when you least can afford it.

 

[waterspout]

I won't get off topic and talk about coachings too much. I've heard tl's and Srtl's say ... Yeah, I gave them a coaching but they didn't even realize it was a coaching. Which I think is shady ... But that is another topic and thread.

 

[Barcode]

You shouldn't need to cue an ominous drumline to know something is a coaching. If they're telling you how to improve on anything, even if it is in a friendly/informal manner, you might be getting coached. Being coached isn't necessarily a bad thing either, there are no consequences from a coaching (until it gets to a CCA that is), and its just an opportunity for you to improve. I've been coached lots, and usually never had anything bad come from it.

 

[Bosch]

You shouldn't need to cue an ominous drumline to know something is a coaching. If they're telling you how to improve on anything, even if it is in a friendly/informal manner, you might be getting coached. Being coached isn't necessarily a bad thing either, there are no consequences from a coaching (until it gets to a CCA that is), and its just an opportunity for you to improve. I've been coached lots, and usually never had anything bad come from it.

There is no incentive to improve.

You call out that there all these pulls on the line, so I pull a few on the floor you never cared that they didn't actually get worked only that the line was cleared? So having vehicles on the floor unattended was better than in the back out of the guests way? The answer was yes it was. The line clear was more important than a clear sales floor so guests could shop.

Wait? What?

 

[consume]

@Signkitty I disagree. I think its healthy to push your limits sometimes. It's the only way you improve.

I think this is an amazing quote for both tls and tms.

Awesome reply.

 

[Bosch]

@Signkitty I disagree. I think its healthy to push your limits sometimes. It's the only way you improve.

I think this is an amazing quote for both tls and tms.

Awesome reply.

With proper support it can be good, but without you are just asking for a mess. I have learned a lot in my life in trial by fire but there comes a time where you just say "yeah no."

 

[redeye58]

I think its healthy to push your limits [B]sometimes[/B]. It's the only way you improve.

 

[Signkitty]

Sorry but as someone who is ASKED for the impossible I disagree with your disagreement. I guess thats the diffrence between being the asker and the asked. Its easy for you to justify it because you just get to walk away and hope for the best. Meanwhile I'm the one that gets all the stress and feels like a failure if it doesn't happen.

 

[CaptainRevision]

Because they give orders, and don't have to do it themselves!


Most of them I am so sick of, and doesn't matter they are good-looking or sweet, but if they don't UNDERSTAND anything that they never done before, they shouldn't judge it easy! And, I would have some problems with these types of people.

 

[CaptainRevision]

They living in a cluew

Part of being a good worker means thinking of alternative ways to accomplish challenges, and working efficiently to complete multiple tasks on time.

Part of being a good manager is knowing whether the workload you've assigned your subordinates is POSSIBLE. I've had TMs look at me like they thought I was clueless for what I was asking them to do -- they were just incapable of completing something that I already knew could be completed because I've done it before.


The TMs on my team that were the best, I would always ask them to do more than I thought was possible, and sometimes I was pleasantly surprised that they found a way to get it all done. Usually they would say "I'll try my best to get that all done, and keep you updated", or something to that nature. If they didn't finish, I usually wouldn't make a big deal of it since they would usually come close; and they were always good communicators on what was accomplished.

Here is the problem, if you demand the impossible, and those who feel the immense pressure they would do a hurry-up job that's half-assed and fast yet not quality enough job in order to meet the time.

Hopefully, this isn't being over-looked by managers think they know their employees. Push the impossible, then you often will get crappy results (that you often may not know about)

 

[CaptainRevision]

Part of being a good worker means thinking of alternative ways to accomplish challenges, and working efficiently to complete multiple tasks on time.

Part of being a good manager is knowing whether the workload you've assigned your subordinates is POSSIBLE. I've had TMs look at me like they thought I was clueless for what I was asking them to do -- they were just incapable of completing something that I already knew could be completed because I've done it before.


The TMs on my team that were the best, I would always ask them to do more than I thought was possible, and sometimes I was pleasantly surprised that they found a way to get it all done. Usually they would say "I'll try my best to get that all done, and keep you updated", or something to that nature. If they didn't finish, I usually wouldn't make a big deal of it since they would usually come close; and they were always good communicators on what was accomplished.

I disagree. My job is not to come up with ALTERNATIVE ways to accomplish a task. My job is to follow best practices and my supervisors directions.

The problem in this situation is that I have far more experience than either my tl or etl. I was given an unachievable goal. When I expressed my opinion about way I believe it is unachievable, I'm told to simply "make it happen." When I ask how, I'm answered with silence.

Unfortunately, I actually still have a nugget of morality left in me. I can't just blindly move baby food without looking at the dates. Or clean.

You're just doing the bare minimum then, and will be looked over in favor of people who seek to excel.

Your TL didn't ask you if it could be done or not, they asked you to do it. The proper response would be, "I'll do my best, but it will be difficult". By asking "how" to do it, I'm sure they're probably looking at you like "Do I need to teach them how to zone a shelf again?"

I've assigned TMs in Guest Service (when I was a GSA) impossible tasks, and if they asked me "how", I would probably stare at them too. Heres a hint: Sometimes it isn't expected that you actually finish ALL of an impossible task. However it is given for one simple reason, to motivate you. If we just let you do the "usual" easy workload, people get lazy and take their time. When we set the bar higher, people will work more efficiently and overall accomplish more.

Ummm, that Target manager wrongful thinking simply need to go away. This STUPID mindset is simply destroying Target as a good place to work at!

For one, most of you DON'T do enough of what we do to realize how miserable the work can actually be. People have actually wanted to quit so bad because of these impossible demands.

You maybe thinking "Oh we will just find another person" Here is a hint, you will hardly find people that can honestly do the job that's impossible. Even if you MAY found one, what makes you think they will even want to work for a company like Target when their talents warrants them a BETTER job? And if you actually found one, becareful, you might found a LIAR instead. And, I bet most of them are (Liars). I think you will only find fake people that tell you they do the fast, but they actually did a half-assed job.

Target's problem is often they don't get how many people in order to be fast, they completely do a half-assed job all the time. Trust me, for the good of the integrity of store, you don't want to prefer liars over honest workers who tells you truth that work is impossible!

Managers doesn't seem to know who actually caused these half-assed jobs, since there are so many employees in the store that could done it.

I KNOW this for a FACT!

The point is, asking people to do an impossible job is not a good thing in the end, causing half-assed jobs thru out which effect overall performance in the end. Thinking otherwise is just total ignorance and fooled yourself (on who actually did a better job)! Ignorant is NOT motivation!

 

[CaptainRevision]

@Signkitty I disagree. I think its healthy to push your limits sometimes. It's the only way you improve.

*sigh* SignKitty is 100% RIGHT! There is an absolutely abundance of ignorance on how employees who actually cares are stressed/give up/nervous breakdown/want to quit and those who are lazy/don't care just LIE to your face that they are better than those who care. And you don't even know (they did a half-assed job) and you think they telling you the truth just because they tell you what you want to hear!

SO MUCH IGNORANCE!!!!!!!!!

 

[Barcode]

Setting difficult goals is a part of life. Get used to it, or prepare to miss out.

 

[CaptainRevision]

LOL I would love to see somehow the day that bosses knows how to talk, get to actually do ALL the work themselves, see how they would feel then.


Talk is always easier and takes no effort to do! Any body can talk and say to others "You can do it. It's not that hard. Just challenge yourself and you can get it done" but it's simply NOT realistic!


TRUST me, I am as much an idealist if not more than anyone in this world, but once I experienced something myself, I know very well what's ignorance and what's truth in this matter!

Idealism isn't about ignoring the truth and come up with something that's completely senseless, at all!

Some work, by design and nature, and not by anyone's speed or effort, is just impossible, period. NO amount of motivation would change that, period.

 

[Bosch]

Setting difficult goals is a part of life. Get used to it, or prepare to miss out.

This is not the normal working mode and its not going to keep getting you the results you want. It is not a state of normal to do the impossible you burn out people, people get hurt. And when you ask impossible you leave them alone and give them what they need to get it done. Nope not target "have no tools, no working equipment, and no support and better yet we had 5 cashier call outs so be sure your radio is on so you can back up every 5min for one guest. So you will waste two hours of your six hour shift walking back and forth to the check lanes."

 

[SpotCrazy]

Ive been wanting to clean up my electronics stockroom for a bit and get it ready for the holidays. Plus giftcards never get pushed and hundreds of gift cards are discontinued so I've been working on it one row a day or so. Trashing as I go along.
I call my stl over to ask if I can get an hour after my e&e shift to finish it. She's says that it's back room's job. Which I understand but they've been swamped for weeks. She says that I need to be out improving aar and selling. ( I've had only 1 guest in the last 4 hours) okay I get that too. So I get with backroom and ask for 20 minutes when they have it to locu giftcards.
Well then I ask for my lunch and stl says to leave the keys in register and she'd listen out for calls .....from hba.... uhhh what? Hypocritical much? Way to lead by example.

I'm probably just being grumpy pants but that makes no kind of sense to me.

Edit: oh and she's lod right now...

 

[CaptainRevision]

SpotCrazy, TBH that's not even bad. Because you done your job, and you want to do MORE, something you are not hired to do. I don't think it's that unreasonable or clueless a manager would tell you to not get extra hours to do that. Compared to what some of us get to deal with (NOT even able to complete the tasks that we ARE hired to do due to clueless bosses), this seems to be nothing.

 

[CaptainRevision]

Actually, nevermind what I said. I think I know what you mean, you mean that the backroom is WAY BEHIND, and they can't even get their job done because of short staffing and lack of help, correct? You wanted to help the backroom, but the manager doesn't seem to care that the backroom get caught up, and allow it to get behind, right?

 

[monkeyman90]

my two cents: no one ever trains on managing people.someone isn't getting the right scores, i really can't give them great advice. i did what worked for me, but i've been there whenever etl's had a great idea things would work. it worked less than what i usually did. all corp cares is the managers can point to things they did to improve it if the scores/#'s aren't what's needed.

we can give horrible advice, and its still ok. we'll fire the cashiers, but the management stays

most new people don't know the system and prioritize different things.

i sweat running around guest service making sure everything is clear and brand. after i get things brand i have a lot of down time, which is where i learned my stuff. i'm the only one who tries. i tell our guest service team procedures, as i wanted to be in charge of that since i know more guest service than anyone in the district apparently. it never gets done.

 

[waterspout]

Setting difficult goals is a part of life. Get used to it, or prepare to miss out.

You state this as if it's a fact. It sounds more like a motto. The Earth turning is a fact of life.

I don't mind setting goals. The problem I have are unattainable goals.

When the people setting the goals are clueless, that's when there are problems.

Also, why is there always, ALWAYS, this discrepancy between hours on the adjacency calendar and what stores schedule? It seems needlessly complicated. Target corp sends all these stores a list saying ... Hey, here is how long this will take. But then the stores play loose and free with it. I get it's a guide. But like I said, needlessly complicated.

 

[Barcode]

Setting difficult goals is a part of life. Get used to it, or prepare to miss out.

You state this as if it's a fact. It sounds more like a motto. The Earth turning is a fact of life.

I don't mind setting goals. The problem I have are unattainable goals.

When the people setting the goals are clueless, that's when there are problems.

Also, why is there always, ALWAYS, this discrepancy between hours on the adjacency calendar and what stores schedule? It seems needlessly complicated. Target corp sends all these stores a list saying ... Hey, here is how long this will take. But then the stores play loose and free with it. I get it's a guide. But like I said, needlessly complicated.

Goals are only unattainable if you give up. Clearly people who make records should have given up because it's not possible! Lol

 

[CaptainRevision]

Once again, I hope that you managers do all the Revs that I do every weekday (which ISN'T easy in any way or form you have to DO it in order to experience the TRUTH) or help set difficult POGs every day, SEE what it is like for yourself, before lecture people about goals as if you know for a fact that people aren't already working their asses off! *SIGH*


I COMPLETELY WORK MY ASSES OFF ALL THE TIME, STILL OFTEN GET BEHIND!

After reading what waterspout said, I realized I am certainly not only person in this situation, the problem is clear as day, yet the only people that wants to argue against it are ALWAYS the people who DON'T do these types of works themselves... think they know what they are talking about but they DON'T!!!


Mark my words, Target will FAIL and lose, if this company continue to be ignorant/clueless and push GOOD employees to a limit that they can not handle. Watch GREAT employees quit, give up (Not your idea of give up but give up on Target's stupid ways), and find other jobs instead of give their best at Target that seem to no longer be respected or valued!

As I said earlier, all you gonna end up are mostly LIARS who do half-assed jobs that you don't even have an idea who they are. Maybe most, maybe all, how would you know?


GOOD employees are truly hard to find, don't force them out with unrealistic expectations, or you are just a stupid employer!

 

[CaptainRevision]

Setting difficult goals is a part of life. Get used to it, or prepare to miss out.

You state this as if it's a fact. It sounds more like a motto. The Earth turning is a fact of life.

I don't mind setting goals. The problem I have are unattainable goals.

When the people setting the goals are clueless, that's when there are problems.

Also, why is there always, ALWAYS, this discrepancy between hours on the adjacency calendar and what stores schedule? It seems needlessly complicated. Target corp sends all these stores a list saying ... Hey, here is how long this will take. But then the stores play loose and free with it. I get it's a guide. But like I said, needlessly complicated.

I AGREE with you!

But, unfortunately I don't know what will our complaint do on a forum here that most people seem to ignore. No top company exec has ever addressed our concerns on this forum.

To solve the problem we have, I feel that we should escalate it to the company top people. Do you have any idea how to do this?